just thinking of rejiging my skaven list even though i've only player one 2000 pts game!

Grey seer
Skalm
Eye of the big rat
warpstone amulet
Screaming Bell!!!
30 clan ratsll command (to push)
rattling gun

warlock engineer
storm demon
scroll

BSB with war banner

assasin
warp stars

21 clan rats full command
rattling gun

21 slaves
21 slaves

21 plague monks
full command
banner of burning hatred

7 jazzails

warp lightning cannon
warp lightning cannon

so what do those skaven players think?

and note to Pete and Gareth! only 6 levels of magic and one dispel scroll!!!

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just when you thought it was safe for sensible conversation!

A seer and 2 engineers with the extra bell dice is a heavy magic phase whatever spin you want to put on it.

This army is leaning towards Shooty Magic Army of Death.

A good tournament list, but in the club environment will not make for such a fun game.

If your magic rolls well you'll probably win, if your magic messes up, you'll probably lose. And with skaven that is entirely possible.

I'd take it on a few outings at club level, and I'd certainly strongly consider taking it to tournaments.

I'm not so sure on the skalm. I think the Twisted Crown would be better, as the skalm can only cure 2 wounds (as the seer has 3), and you've got to be alive to use it! If a vampire, chaos lord, nasty lizard etc gets close, those three wounds will go all at once. The regen from the Crown can keep on saving you.

I'd drop the slaves to 21, drop the clanrat champs (10pts for one WS3 Str3 attack?) and change an engineer into a BSB. You can use the points saved to bulk up the plague monks and jezzails, 'cos they're both a little small.

Though I must admit I've never used a Seer - I use a warlord for the extra Ld, and more horde!

Units of 25 clanrats? They need to be at least 40 if they want to survive the game. It's not like they cost many points, so it shouldn't be much of a problem to rejig the points around.

Like The Adept said, the Plague Monks are also a bit small. As soon as you lose any models, you lose a rank bonus. I know that the monks don't need it straight away because of their frenzy, but when it gets to combat they need the bonus (they are only str 3, after all).

Definitely take the Twisted Crown over Skalm. The Grey Seer is not as safe as people think when sat on that screaming bell, he can take some hits from ranged attacks and its nice to have some kind of save just in case a stray cannon ball hits him in the face. Lot of points tied up in one model is all.

the theory of the skalm was more for when he zaps himself! but he does need an upgrade! i will think about bulking up the other units but at the moment i wanted to go with a list that i dont need to add to much to the models i already have, so although it seems like a shooty army f magical death! i am trying to move away from that into a more balanced army,

i'll give it a proper test in the coming weeks and the campaign will give me that opportunity too! and i want to get a good feel for the better units for when i do go to another tournament at some point

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just when you thought it was safe for sensible conversation!

Tenebrous cloak is a good bet againt frying himself.

3+ ward vrs magical and non magical missiles. Warp Lightning is a magical missile, so he can take the save.

conductors, crates, connifers

No use against the warpstone chunks, though. Plus, he might not get warp lightning. I suppose if you're careful (and not on a bell!) you can skitterleap to avoid combat, making the cloak more useful.

so how about if i put a battle standard in the unit with the storm banner, which will help for at least one turn, hopefully more and made the unit bigger.

also give the plague monks the umbranner and make them 30 large, maybe even chuck in a plague priest to bolster their attacks?

i also thought about a master moulder with bands of power and a man catcher behind 4 rat ogres? that was just something i was toying with or give him skaven brew!

i do like the idea of skalm though as a Grey seer is a lot of points and he can lose them himself or from the bell and with no save! how about the cloak and skalm? and with the storm banner working it would make him difficult enough to hit anyway!

it's something to try and i will be getting a bell to try it out, as i think it could be lots of fun!

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just when you thought it was safe for sensible conversation!

Battle Standard? Storm Banner? Plague Priest?

This sounds like a completely different list Ali, have I missed something?

Storms, Sausages, Silliness

Yes to the BSB. Skaven should always have a BSB, as the re-roll can be vital. Plus, skaven are all about static CR (you're not exspecting your rats to kill anything in combat, are you?), and a BSB is some static CR that can move from unit to unit if required. Try the Banner of the Swarm or the War Banner on him, unless you're facing a very shooty army, then take the Storm Banner.

Just remeber you can't control when the storm banner stops, so it'll likely effect your WLCs, jezzails and rattlers.

The unit hoping BSB with the warbanner is fantastic.

He adds extra Ld (vital) extra +2 combat res (try shitfing those storm vermin now pal) and a re-roll on the break test. All critical things in a skaven army.

My character builds for skaven are either:
Seer, BSB, Engineer, Assassin/Priest
Or: Warlord, BSB, 2x Engineers.

I'm not a storm banner fan, as it is too opponent specific and effects my own shooting too. The Umbanner is good on StormVermin, coupled with the BSB. The Banner of Burning Hatred for Plague Monks is a no-brainer, but be careful with that compulsary move, as it happens before normal moves and you may end up blocking the path of your plague monks. (Especially if there are some opponents on a hill, and some Censor Bearers in front of your unit - Doh! )

However, you list looks more like going extreme. Seer, 2 Engineers, BSB gives you a solid magic phase, expecially with the Bell. Keep the bell pushers big, I'd be tempted at having all others at about 21, unless you actually want them around, and spend all the points you can muster on the lovely weapons that skaven can muster. There is nothing that puts fear into big dragons and steam tanks than lines of Jezzails and Cannons staring at them. Chitty chitty bang bang.

Cars, Crates, Careers